One thing IтАЩve been most disappointed by in life is joining this group and discovering most BARPod listeners are at best right-wing loons. At worst, political nihilists who want to watch the world burn for LOLz.
ItтАЩs nice to see some people understand itтАЩs possible to oppose far-left nonsense and still be liberal.
Seriously? You think that describes most commenters here? I might say that about the Free Press comment section (itтАЩs a horror show), but I think most commenters here are variations on Jesse and Katie: People who used to be very liberal and/or big-P Progressive and/or leftist who became disillusioned by the extremists and the ridiculous aspects of the culture wars, but who actively resist going over to the right wing because it doesnтАЩt align with our values at all and we resent how craziness on the left makes the right sometimes look like the more reasonable side. Youth gender medicine is probably the prime example. As a result, weтАЩre in a tough place, but we donтАЩt want to burn everything to the ground, we just want our old friends and allies to come to their senses and not squander the very real social gains Democrats in the US (and equivalents in other countries) have made.
Well put, thank you. (And yes, your description of the Free Press commentariat is spot on - and IтАЩm sure Bari and Nellie are repulsed by their fandom, btw. And no, I donтАЩt blame them (Bari and Nellie) at all. I admire them. I just donтАЩt agree with them at several points. FYI.)
Agree. I see so much conspiracy thinking among friends and family who vote D and R. Honestly listening to cult survivor podcasts is the one thing that got me through the last few years. It gives me hope that even the Truest of Believers might be pushed too far by the rules of the cult and snap out from the brain fog.
That hasnтАЩt been my experience. The people IтАЩm talking about think Jesse and Katie are too far-left. They moan about being тАЬpolitically homelessтАЭ while consistently excusing far-right nonsense.
For example, one absolute knob said he didnтАЩt care if abortion was banned becauseтАж it didnтАЩt affect him or his wife. HeтАЩs not тАЬdisillusionedтАЭ or politically homeless, heтАЩs a right-winger who тАФ for whatever reason тАФ refuses to identify as such.
Bad read, Noah. I appreciate your point of view, itтАЩs giving me pause to review the situation here, but at end of day, itтАЩs just dead wrong. What youтАЩre describing is EXACTLY the Free Press commentators. Go check that out and report back. IтАЩll waitтАж
How is this an example of a тАШright wingerтАЩ? Right wingers normally base their anti abortion stance on what they conceive of as moral or religious reasons (eg. тАЬavoid terminating innocent lifeтАЭ or тАЬdonтАЩt cancel soulsтАЭ) I donтАЩt think IтАЩve ever heard a right winger justify an anti abortion stance on the fact that it doesnтАЩt affect them.
I see less of that in the non-episode threads, but also I feel heartened a bit that people to the right, and even way further to the right than I am, will still engage with me and others who don't agree with them when we're not discussing politics, even if we really locked horns in another thread.
Right. This is a reason I'm leaning toward "continue to avoid politics." I like the mix of people and the engagement on other topics that transcends that shit; I think it's a big part of the draw of the show (to my mind anyway). I wouldn't want this space devolving into outrage over this or that take (any more than just normally happens online when you discuss anything).
Politics is the way we organize and fund society. ThereтАЩs no such thing as тАЬAvoiding politicsтАЭ. Even the refusal to support any political candidate is a political decision тАФ as if impacts how society is organized and funded
I don't think it's the majority, but I have learned from reading these comments that a lot of people who describe themselves as "heterodox" are actually conservative. At least, it's a red flag.
I donтАЩt think it is a majority BUT you are hitting on something here. There are a group of people (multiple) who will gang up on left wing perspectives in a way I donтАЩt see for right wing perspectives.
For example:
People are not gonna get piled on for saying things that imply that all Palestinians are as bad as Hamas, but they will get piled on for saying things that imply that all Israelis are genocidal.
That's a silly example. 70% or so of Palestinians support Hamas, and put them in power. I highly doubt that 70% of Israelis are like "ya kill all the Palestinians, dat's kool." So it's a weird lefty example.
ItтАЩs not that silly. If you think that Palestinians тАЬsupporting HamasтАЭ means they think тАЬya kill all the Jews dats koolтАЭ youтАЩre being just as weird. Most support Hamas because they (incorrectly in my view, but understandably given the circumstances) believe that the Israeli army wants to kill them all or at least force them to abandon their homes/nation
I would fall into the political nihilism crowd. I just went on a rant here saying I donтАЩt vote and my favorite American politician is Lori Lightfoot because she wore Rona Destroyer costume to a press conference in 2020. If the world actually started burning I would try to make money off it, they call it war profiteering and if that didnтАЩt work just grab popcorn and enjoy the LOLz
It may look like nihilism to many but it's actually just the realization that nothing can be changed under the current circumstances because a preponderance of the voting public is fine with what we have now. Specifically anyone older than GenX is to blame: they gave us Biden and Trump and they are Biden and Trump.
Boomers got us into this mess and they simply aren't willing to step aside and allow anyone else to fix our problems. They seem to want to calcify our politics so that they can live out their remaining years with social security, medicare, and their home/profits from house sale.
They have, for example, left the planet worse off, refused to do anything about it, and have taken over the upper echelons/position of powers of institutions and refuse to retire.
Quite frankly insulting to have to watch two old men barely be able to shuffle up to the podium on debate night, both bent over, incoherent, and estranged from reality. Especially since both participants have been more or less active in shutting down any possibility for advancement of younger politicians.
IтАЩm kind of similar but I acknowledge my detachment and cynicism comes from a deep seated fear. It sucks to not know what to believe and to second guess everything you hearтАжeven from trusted friends and family.
My nihilism comes from paying attention too much for a long time when I was younger. Then all of sudden I just woke up and said if they arenтАЩt going to care then why should I care.
Oh my god, I love you. Exactly. The fact the far-left is insane is not reason to join the authoritarian right.
I will say I absolutely agree with you guys on this point and I am impressed with Katie and Jesse for not going down that route.
One thing IтАЩve been most disappointed by in life is joining this group and discovering most BARPod listeners are at best right-wing loons. At worst, political nihilists who want to watch the world burn for LOLz.
ItтАЩs nice to see some people understand itтАЩs possible to oppose far-left nonsense and still be liberal.
Seriously? You think that describes most commenters here? I might say that about the Free Press comment section (itтАЩs a horror show), but I think most commenters here are variations on Jesse and Katie: People who used to be very liberal and/or big-P Progressive and/or leftist who became disillusioned by the extremists and the ridiculous aspects of the culture wars, but who actively resist going over to the right wing because it doesnтАЩt align with our values at all and we resent how craziness on the left makes the right sometimes look like the more reasonable side. Youth gender medicine is probably the prime example. As a result, weтАЩre in a tough place, but we donтАЩt want to burn everything to the ground, we just want our old friends and allies to come to their senses and not squander the very real social gains Democrats in the US (and equivalents in other countries) have made.
Well put, thank you. (And yes, your description of the Free Press commentariat is spot on - and IтАЩm sure Bari and Nellie are repulsed by their fandom, btw. And no, I donтАЩt blame them (Bari and Nellie) at all. I admire them. I just donтАЩt agree with them at several points. FYI.)
Agree. I see so much conspiracy thinking among friends and family who vote D and R. Honestly listening to cult survivor podcasts is the one thing that got me through the last few years. It gives me hope that even the Truest of Believers might be pushed too far by the rules of the cult and snap out from the brain fog.
That hasnтАЩt been my experience. The people IтАЩm talking about think Jesse and Katie are too far-left. They moan about being тАЬpolitically homelessтАЭ while consistently excusing far-right nonsense.
For example, one absolute knob said he didnтАЩt care if abortion was banned becauseтАж it didnтАЩt affect him or his wife. HeтАЩs not тАЬdisillusionedтАЭ or politically homeless, heтАЩs a right-winger who тАФ for whatever reason тАФ refuses to identify as such.
Bad read, Noah. I appreciate your point of view, itтАЩs giving me pause to review the situation here, but at end of day, itтАЩs just dead wrong. What youтАЩre describing is EXACTLY the Free Press commentators. Go check that out and report back. IтАЩll waitтАж
They are far, far from the majority here.
You're describing Free Press comment section, not barpod.
That anecdote is meaningless and every comment section has ridiculous people in it.
How is this an example of a тАШright wingerтАЩ? Right wingers normally base their anti abortion stance on what they conceive of as moral or religious reasons (eg. тАЬavoid terminating innocent lifeтАЭ or тАЬdonтАЩt cancel soulsтАЭ) I donтАЩt think IтАЩve ever heard a right winger justify an anti abortion stance on the fact that it doesnтАЩt affect them.
Perhaps тАЬpolitical nihilistтАЭ is a more precise term.
Whatever his motivation, the effect is exactly the same as batshit right-wing anti-abortion policy: women are forced to birth babies they do not want.
ThatтАЩs some Of-Fred shit no matter the intent.
Perfectly sums it up for me too!
New Zagarna just dropped!
I see less of that in the non-episode threads, but also I feel heartened a bit that people to the right, and even way further to the right than I am, will still engage with me and others who don't agree with them when we're not discussing politics, even if we really locked horns in another thread.
Right. This is a reason I'm leaning toward "continue to avoid politics." I like the mix of people and the engagement on other topics that transcends that shit; I think it's a big part of the draw of the show (to my mind anyway). I wouldn't want this space devolving into outrage over this or that take (any more than just normally happens online when you discuss anything).
Politics is the way we organize and fund society. ThereтАЩs no such thing as тАЬAvoiding politicsтАЭ. Even the refusal to support any political candidate is a political decision тАФ as if impacts how society is organized and funded
Your approach to life sounds exhausting. It might be why you only find extremists with too much time there?
I lean to the Right, quasi-libertarian, and I've been a subscriber a long time. I don't think I'm a right-wing loon ЁЯШВ.
Sounds like me. I guess the question is probably Trump 2024?
If yes loon.
If no youтАЩre one of the good ones.
IтАЩm a loon.
Huh?
Have you logged on to the wrong podcast?
I don't think it's the majority, but I have learned from reading these comments that a lot of people who describe themselves as "heterodox" are actually conservative. At least, it's a red flag.
Yea. I donтАЩt know why they donтАЩt just identify as what they obviously are.
I donтАЩt think it is a majority BUT you are hitting on something here. There are a group of people (multiple) who will gang up on left wing perspectives in a way I donтАЩt see for right wing perspectives.
For example:
People are not gonna get piled on for saying things that imply that all Palestinians are as bad as Hamas, but they will get piled on for saying things that imply that all Israelis are genocidal.
There are examples in other issues as well.
That's a silly example. 70% or so of Palestinians support Hamas, and put them in power. I highly doubt that 70% of Israelis are like "ya kill all the Palestinians, dat's kool." So it's a weird lefty example.
ItтАЩs not that silly. If you think that Palestinians тАЬsupporting HamasтАЭ means they think тАЬya kill all the Jews dats koolтАЭ youтАЩre being just as weird. Most support Hamas because they (incorrectly in my view, but understandably given the circumstances) believe that the Israeli army wants to kill them all or at least force them to abandon their homes/nation
Yep
"Right-wing loon" meaning what exactly?
If you have to ask, itтАЩs because you are one.
You are behaving exactly like the kind of people you make accusations against, and this stupid comment is a perfect example of that.
I would fall into the political nihilism crowd. I just went on a rant here saying I donтАЩt vote and my favorite American politician is Lori Lightfoot because she wore Rona Destroyer costume to a press conference in 2020. If the world actually started burning I would try to make money off it, they call it war profiteering and if that didnтАЩt work just grab popcorn and enjoy the LOLz
Not sure why you'd consider that a flex.
It may look like nihilism to many but it's actually just the realization that nothing can be changed under the current circumstances because a preponderance of the voting public is fine with what we have now. Specifically anyone older than GenX is to blame: they gave us Biden and Trump and they are Biden and Trump.
Boomers got us into this mess and they simply aren't willing to step aside and allow anyone else to fix our problems. They seem to want to calcify our politics so that they can live out their remaining years with social security, medicare, and their home/profits from house sale.
They have, for example, left the planet worse off, refused to do anything about it, and have taken over the upper echelons/position of powers of institutions and refuse to retire.
Quite frankly insulting to have to watch two old men barely be able to shuffle up to the podium on debate night, both bent over, incoherent, and estranged from reality. Especially since both participants have been more or less active in shutting down any possibility for advancement of younger politicians.
IтАЩm kind of similar but I acknowledge my detachment and cynicism comes from a deep seated fear. It sucks to not know what to believe and to second guess everything you hearтАжeven from trusted friends and family.
My nihilism comes from paying attention too much for a long time when I was younger. Then all of sudden I just woke up and said if they arenтАЩt going to care then why should I care.