If there was ever any doubt that "trans rights" isn't (in large part) a male supremacist movement, behold the speed with which narcissistic injury has obliterated a website which laughed at men.
I do think Kiwifarms is a pretty bad place, but I really don't think you can make a strong case that anything that is being done on their is really all that different/worse than stuff you see on major social media sites that no one is calling to be deplatformed.
This whole saga really just seems like a person co-opting social issues to take down a site that was airing her dirty laundry.
Before all this I had visited KiwiFarms occasionally but since Keffels started this campaign I've been on the site every day that it's been up so.... hello, Streisand effect.
I'm hard pressed to think of a recent situation where a supposed victim has been as unsympathetic as Keffals has been during this entire time. I don't know how anyone could look at her history and not see that she's a complete bully and narcissist who gets off on the stupidest shit. Even while admitting that the police showing up and arresting you for something you didn't do is a terrifying experience, the way she has handled this situation and chosen to actively provoke her enemies makes it difficult to entertain taking her side in this.
Anyway, great job Katie and Jesse on delving into this story that truly exemplifies the worst of our times.
Was interesting hearing two Americans trying to sum up The Troubles in less than a minute (I give your summation a 7/10).
It's interesting to note that giving the recent history of the province (in the past 10 years particularly) that an LGBT person hoping to escape harassment and ill treatment decides that the best place to be safe is NORTHERN IRELAND.
"She helps to supply hormones to trans kids w/o their parents permission." "Isn't that illegal, Jesse?" -- then Jesse says to "set that aside."
It's incredibly illegal, Jesse, even if ppl sympathetic to the issue of kids with gender dysphoria don't want to admit it. If nothing happens on the legal front to Keffals and Eli Erlick for coordinating the delivery of prescription medications, especially Schedule III drugs like testosterone -- lots of ppl are going to be hurt. Not a lawyer, but transferring meds across state lines using US mail is a federal felony. If these hormones are not administered properly there is a medical risk to people OTHER than the person using them. https://www.insider.com/testosterone-gel-toddler-puberty-early-2022-06
A f-ing doctor could lose their license for prescribing meds to a person they don't have as a patient, at any age. And here we have trans rights extremists playing pharmacist & illegally supplying minors with prescription medication & if you want to #supporTransKids I guess that's okay now?
Looking forward to the first lawsuit against one of these ppl for harming a child. They have no right to do this, no matter how right they think they are.
Jesse - stop twitter replying to all of the Trans activists. They are the only ones gunning for you and much less consequential than their twitter activism on would suggest.
The target donations were at least at $20k to begin with and she kept raising it by like 10k+ increments every time the goal was reach or was close to reaching until it was at the current 100k target. You can see it all in the archives of the gofundme.
1. Excellent episode, brilliant work Trace & Jesse for research, Jesse for reporting and Katie (so ironically) being an excellent straightman and giving sane reactions to this insanity.
(Jesse: “……..Catboi Ranch”
Katie: “nooo nononononononono”)
2. Can’t wait for Part II!!1!1!!!1
3. I was worried you weren’t going to circle back to the assault rifle claim! Glad to be mistaken.
4. I think we can agree that the lolcows aren’t the only ones getting milked in this saga. Whatever you think of Keffals, that’s some savvy entrepreneurship. And don’t forget, that was $100K US dollars. To us Canadians like the fortunes of all our maple syrup magnates combined.
There needs to be some serious inquiry into what is actually happening here. The insane amount of baseless reporting by every single “news” outlet, every service provider dropping essential services based on zero evidence, and the 24/7 ddos attacks do not make ANY sense. At all.
I’ve never seen any website be so thoroughly and rapidly suppressed without committing serious, credible crimes. Even then, it takes a long time. There were numerous spree shooters posting on 8chan & 4chan, and the Christchurch shooting (that’s being blamed on KF) was live-streamed on Facebook!
This response seems massively lopsided. KF is not a threat especially when compared to social media platforms and has never broken any laws.
Every person needs to be concerned about the gaslighting and manipulation that’s happening. I’ve never been a “MSM is filled with lies” person until now. And conveniently enough, no random person reading any of the reporting can fact check because they are even wiping out ARCHIVES!
It’s scary how we’re watching the very concept of free expression be demolished in real time. This just seems to go way beyond an online slap fight.
Just wondering: If KF was removed from the Internet Archive, but is now on Tor, is the whole thing still intact? All of it going backwards in time?
I would read the KF SRS thread regularly (which never focused on one person, but was just about anyone who had a problem with SRS surgery) b/c I am fascinated by what goes wrong with the surgeries. (This thread was NOT for the squeamish and included graphic images of the surgical results.) I can report that in a thread like that it is a mix of people, from obvious bona fide transphobes to people genuinely concerned for the lives of young people being exploited by doctors. That it is such a diverse group is part of what makes it not only fascinating, but the kind of place that a bona fide transphobe might even begin to feel a "sympathy" or "empathy" nerve while reading the posts of fellow farmers. Posts would sometimes be deeply philosophical on this whole issue. Some posts were feminist, some were anti-feminist, some were clearly hateful, some were attempting to speak directly to trans people with great sympathy in an attempt for them to understand the dangers of surgery, to save their future health and sanity. It's the kind of place where people can absorb ideas previously alien to them. In other words, it's one of the few internet forums that was not really encased in a bubble. And to maintain that non-bubble status, and to have that kind of cross-pollination of opinion, yeah, you have to include absolutely everyone, including the assholes.
NB: No doubt there were threads that were far more "bubble" like and far meaner. I had no interest in those. Also, I was just a lurker, not a participant.
Katie makes a really good point that hadn't occurred to me before: we do a ton of hand-wringing over online doxxing.
Yet until about 15 years ago, millions of Americans were listed in a phone book that contained not only their personal phone number, but also their full home address. This phone book was available to anybody and everybody. If I recall correctly, there was a fee to have an unlisted number.
What has happened in the US that we obsess over the disclosure of information that used to be publicly available as a routine matter?
I see now she is bragging on Twitter about getting the founder removed from Google voice. This seems like absolute madness. This person clearly has a Messiah complex and should not be taken seriously. What a stupid time to be alive.
If there was ever any doubt that "trans rights" isn't (in large part) a male supremacist movement, behold the speed with which narcissistic injury has obliterated a website which laughed at men.
I do think Kiwifarms is a pretty bad place, but I really don't think you can make a strong case that anything that is being done on their is really all that different/worse than stuff you see on major social media sites that no one is calling to be deplatformed.
This whole saga really just seems like a person co-opting social issues to take down a site that was airing her dirty laundry.
Before all this I had visited KiwiFarms occasionally but since Keffels started this campaign I've been on the site every day that it's been up so.... hello, Streisand effect.
I'm hard pressed to think of a recent situation where a supposed victim has been as unsympathetic as Keffals has been during this entire time. I don't know how anyone could look at her history and not see that she's a complete bully and narcissist who gets off on the stupidest shit. Even while admitting that the police showing up and arresting you for something you didn't do is a terrifying experience, the way she has handled this situation and chosen to actively provoke her enemies makes it difficult to entertain taking her side in this.
Anyway, great job Katie and Jesse on delving into this story that truly exemplifies the worst of our times.
Does someone whose only copy of their thesis lives on an external hard drive deserve a PhD?
Or am I just displaying backup privilege?
Was interesting hearing two Americans trying to sum up The Troubles in less than a minute (I give your summation a 7/10).
It's interesting to note that giving the recent history of the province (in the past 10 years particularly) that an LGBT person hoping to escape harassment and ill treatment decides that the best place to be safe is NORTHERN IRELAND.
"She helps to supply hormones to trans kids w/o their parents permission." "Isn't that illegal, Jesse?" -- then Jesse says to "set that aside."
It's incredibly illegal, Jesse, even if ppl sympathetic to the issue of kids with gender dysphoria don't want to admit it. If nothing happens on the legal front to Keffals and Eli Erlick for coordinating the delivery of prescription medications, especially Schedule III drugs like testosterone -- lots of ppl are going to be hurt. Not a lawyer, but transferring meds across state lines using US mail is a federal felony. If these hormones are not administered properly there is a medical risk to people OTHER than the person using them. https://www.insider.com/testosterone-gel-toddler-puberty-early-2022-06
A f-ing doctor could lose their license for prescribing meds to a person they don't have as a patient, at any age. And here we have trans rights extremists playing pharmacist & illegally supplying minors with prescription medication & if you want to #supporTransKids I guess that's okay now?
Looking forward to the first lawsuit against one of these ppl for harming a child. They have no right to do this, no matter how right they think they are.
Instinctively I feel like 'troon' doesn't mean 'trans activist' as much as 'trans person with AGP who doesn't pass well and is kind of cringey online'
Jesse - stop twitter replying to all of the Trans activists. They are the only ones gunning for you and much less consequential than their twitter activism on would suggest.
Correction on the Keffals gofundme:
The target donations were at least at $20k to begin with and she kept raising it by like 10k+ increments every time the goal was reach or was close to reaching until it was at the current 100k target. You can see it all in the archives of the gofundme.
You really said "she raped her mother" with a straight face? If ever there was an argument against using preferred pronouns, this is it.
10 min from the end, have to say:
1. Excellent episode, brilliant work Trace & Jesse for research, Jesse for reporting and Katie (so ironically) being an excellent straightman and giving sane reactions to this insanity.
(Jesse: “……..Catboi Ranch”
Katie: “nooo nononononononono”)
2. Can’t wait for Part II!!1!1!!!1
3. I was worried you weren’t going to circle back to the assault rifle claim! Glad to be mistaken.
4. I think we can agree that the lolcows aren’t the only ones getting milked in this saga. Whatever you think of Keffals, that’s some savvy entrepreneurship. And don’t forget, that was $100K US dollars. To us Canadians like the fortunes of all our maple syrup magnates combined.
There needs to be some serious inquiry into what is actually happening here. The insane amount of baseless reporting by every single “news” outlet, every service provider dropping essential services based on zero evidence, and the 24/7 ddos attacks do not make ANY sense. At all.
I’ve never seen any website be so thoroughly and rapidly suppressed without committing serious, credible crimes. Even then, it takes a long time. There were numerous spree shooters posting on 8chan & 4chan, and the Christchurch shooting (that’s being blamed on KF) was live-streamed on Facebook!
This response seems massively lopsided. KF is not a threat especially when compared to social media platforms and has never broken any laws.
Every person needs to be concerned about the gaslighting and manipulation that’s happening. I’ve never been a “MSM is filled with lies” person until now. And conveniently enough, no random person reading any of the reporting can fact check because they are even wiping out ARCHIVES!
It’s scary how we’re watching the very concept of free expression be demolished in real time. This just seems to go way beyond an online slap fight.
Just wondering: If KF was removed from the Internet Archive, but is now on Tor, is the whole thing still intact? All of it going backwards in time?
I would read the KF SRS thread regularly (which never focused on one person, but was just about anyone who had a problem with SRS surgery) b/c I am fascinated by what goes wrong with the surgeries. (This thread was NOT for the squeamish and included graphic images of the surgical results.) I can report that in a thread like that it is a mix of people, from obvious bona fide transphobes to people genuinely concerned for the lives of young people being exploited by doctors. That it is such a diverse group is part of what makes it not only fascinating, but the kind of place that a bona fide transphobe might even begin to feel a "sympathy" or "empathy" nerve while reading the posts of fellow farmers. Posts would sometimes be deeply philosophical on this whole issue. Some posts were feminist, some were anti-feminist, some were clearly hateful, some were attempting to speak directly to trans people with great sympathy in an attempt for them to understand the dangers of surgery, to save their future health and sanity. It's the kind of place where people can absorb ideas previously alien to them. In other words, it's one of the few internet forums that was not really encased in a bubble. And to maintain that non-bubble status, and to have that kind of cross-pollination of opinion, yeah, you have to include absolutely everyone, including the assholes.
NB: No doubt there were threads that were far more "bubble" like and far meaner. I had no interest in those. Also, I was just a lurker, not a participant.
Katie makes a really good point that hadn't occurred to me before: we do a ton of hand-wringing over online doxxing.
Yet until about 15 years ago, millions of Americans were listed in a phone book that contained not only their personal phone number, but also their full home address. This phone book was available to anybody and everybody. If I recall correctly, there was a fee to have an unlisted number.
What has happened in the US that we obsess over the disclosure of information that used to be publicly available as a routine matter?
I see now she is bragging on Twitter about getting the founder removed from Google voice. This seems like absolute madness. This person clearly has a Messiah complex and should not be taken seriously. What a stupid time to be alive.